Curse

Cherno · Mar 25, 2006, 05:31 PM // 17:31

The shield is nice, but not unexpected. You can get the Crimson Carapace from a collector so I would be upset if you couldn't get this version from a collector as well.

For all those crying the fall of the greens because of the 20/20 wands/rods. Remember that these items, unlike most of the greens, have no energy mod built it.

For some this won't matter, but they are not strictly better than what we have now. The only one I consider to be really better is the Curses 20/20 rod because vilnars gives the +5 when hexed, which doesn't usually happen anyway, so I just usually pretend it isn't even part of the wand.

Cybah · Mar 25, 2006, 06:24 PM // 18:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherno

You can get the Crimson Carapace from a collector so I would be upset if you couldn't get this version from a collector as well.

There is currently:

NO -2 -2 collector shield

NO +45/-2 enchanted collector shield

NO +30 always collector shield (u get this only with bulwark)

NO -2 -3 hexed collector shield

and so on.

Why not make them ALL collectable? omg I think you are all pvp playing only.

edit: and where are the collectors for +30 always +10 vs dwarfs, vs skeletons, vs imps, vs....

OMG!

Bitoku Kishi · Mar 25, 2006, 06:27 PM // 18:27

The new green items had better be even better than these collector's items. That's all I have to say.

Cybah · Mar 25, 2006, 06:29 PM // 18:29

if any green shield (which has to have new stats) is better than this collectors shield, this shield would be imbalanced >> won't exist.

Aaelos · Mar 25, 2006, 06:36 PM // 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cybah

the thing is:

+30 -5 20% is TOTALLY without any conditions. this is just a shield u can use EVERYTIME EVERYWHERE. EVEN ALWAYS IN PVP.

think about. that's why it should be damn rare IN MY opinion...

It might be totally without conditions, but it still has plenty of disadvantages. The other kinds only trigger while in stance/enchanted/hexed, but they give +45 or +60 hp instead of just +30. If you're using a build which is heavy on stances or enchantments, you'd be better off having the +45 instead. The same with the -5/20%, it works out as an average of -1 always. It goes without saying that -2 is much better if you're going to be in stance or enchanted all the time.

I'm sorry, but it's nowhere near the uber kill-all item you're making it out to be. It works all the time, but on the flipside, it's less effective than the other condition-based shields that are available. It's not uber, just different. ANET are just adding new tactical options to the game.

It's not ruining the economy at all. If prices went UP that would be a ruined economy. I'm sorry, but the idea of calling any economy that allows most people to afford the things they want at cheap prices a BAD one, is just absolutely ridiculous. The only people who are disadvantaged are the super rich whose 'uber' items suddenly start to lose value. My message to those people is stop being greedy and get rid of your grind mentality. Either that or just go and play some hardcore korean MMO instead, where you can grind away for hours to afford the uber-inflated prices. But for heaven's sake, stop complaining on forums every single time ANET try to improve the game.

Bitoku Kishi · Mar 25, 2006, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cybah

if any green shield (which has to have new stats) is better than this collectors shield, this shield would be imbalanced >> won't exist.

Well, can we agree that the new greens should be different from but at least as good as the new collector's items (stats-wise, objectively speaking)?

Bitoku Kishi · Mar 25, 2006, 06:45 PM // 18:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaelos

I'm sorry, but it's nowhere near the uber kill-all item you're making it out to be. It works all the time, but on the flipside, it's less effective than the other condition-based shields that are available. It's not uber, just different. ANET are just adding new tactical options to the game.

I agree with you on this point. And personally I think Victo's Bulwark has been grossly overpriced from the very beginning. I still prefer using Malinon's Shield, even though I have both. But the question remains of why Victo's Bulwark is still worth higher in the market than Malinon's EVER was.

Quote:

It's not ruining the economy at all. If prices went UP that would be a ruined economy. I'm sorry, but the idea of calling any economy that allows most people to afford the things they want at cheap prices a BAD one, is just absolutely ridiculous. The only people who are disadvantaged are the super rich whose 'uber' items suddenly start to lose value.

Actually, the people who suffer most are the non-rich people who would like to get things like 15k armor, or (heaven forbid) FOW armor. If the general economy keeps dropping, but the prices of stuff like that stays constant, then it becomes much harder to get them. FOW armor in particular is nearly impossible to achieve without either (a) being able to solo farm Underworld as easily in the olden days, or (b) having some extremely high priced stuff going around in the economy that people can try farming for.

Personally I don't really care that much about prices dropping. I already have 15k armor sets on all my characters, and a million gold in the bank to spare for Factions when it comes out. But I do think it's bad for people who are still trying to make money in this game, and I feel for them whenever I hear of a green item dropping another 10k-20k in less than a week. Because I know that every time that happens, it's the newcomers and poor people who suffer the most from it, not the rich.

Minus Sign · Mar 25, 2006, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rayea

...it will take a few months at least for the running buisness to get there...

Put yer runnin shoes on boyz! Thats sounds like a challenge!

Seriously though, I don't see how this has a downside to anyone but item horders. I've never had trouble making money and I spend very little time in the Trade Chat.

And I see things like this increasing certain itme prices. Greens in particular. If fewer people haveto farm greens to get the mods they want, they become another FoW sink; something people want for the prestige of acquiring it and not the necessity.

Remember: FoW=Droks on stats. The only reason for items like that is looks.

Sai of Winter · Mar 25, 2006, 07:14 PM // 19:14

I'll use it on my Warrior, but I still think the "30hp always, -2stance" shield is better. I see nothing wrong with this shield on how it would ruin the economy. There will be rare skinned shields with the same stats for those who like to charge these items too high.

I always wonder why people overprice rare items and how they came up with that estimate? :|

Cybah · Mar 25, 2006, 07:48 PM // 19:48

no item is overpriced.

there are only TOO RICH people

Raiin Maker · Mar 25, 2006, 08:02 PM // 20:02

Collectors should have max-perfect item, because most people dont want to spend their entire life playing a game to afford 100000k + thousands of ecto's to buy one max gold. collectors put an end to this. plus max items **wow** they dont make much diffrence-so why not give them away cheap, they're blue not gold, and a gold will ALYWAYS be a gold, and there will always be people with 100000k + thousands of ecto's to afford the stupidly silly golds, for the simple fact that they are, gold.

collectors are, to me - all good. why should players work stupidly hard for stupidly long time to get 1 good item? ANet obusly relise this, thus the new collectors, which i belive are here to stay, why put them in for a preview when our invintries are getting whiped anyway? they're here to stay, and good for us i say. Even though i CAN afford stupidly rare items, i would much rather spend a few hours get a blue collector, and spend the tiem PVP'ing or helping guildies.

Plus you can get most items with perfect mods anyway, they're not even that much (greens + current collectors).

My Opinion=GO ANet! Can't wait till these items can become tradable in a month.

shadowfell · Mar 25, 2006, 08:03 PM // 20:03

Hooray for awesome collector items..!!

SparhawkJC · Mar 25, 2006, 08:26 PM // 20:26

I completely agree with Raiin Maker. The people worried about items destabilizing the the economy have to remember that this is a game, and in the end everything is just worthless bits of code. I still remember why A-Net made this game in the first place. It's supposed to be tactics and strategy not Uber l33t weapons and armor. Somewhere along the way, the majority of the player base lost sight of that. Now we have a very good game, but full of people who don't really understand the point of Guild Wars. What's ruining this game isn't the green and collector's items. It's the runners, the power levelers, the Chinese sweatshops, and the people willing to pay for these things.

Bitoku Kishi · Mar 25, 2006, 08:26 PM // 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cybah

no item is overpriced.

Not even Fissure armor?

SilentAssassin · Mar 25, 2006, 08:27 PM // 20:27

no not even fissure armour,

fissure armour is just for farmers or ebayers, there is something for everyone

OrangeArrow · Mar 25, 2006, 08:34 PM // 20:34

I think this is a step in the right direction PvP characters no longer have any equipment that is superior to an PvE anymore.

Its just became so much easier for a Perfect PvE char that even the most hardcore PvPers will keep one or two around.

The only items worth trading anymore are vanity items, perfect Upgrades, or rare max golds with unusual stats.

I wonder though what will be at the weapons crafters when the game is released part of me thinks maybe +5 energy one Handed moddable weapons?
Most good pvpers who want them have them and a lot of people have said their value is minimal in pvp... who knows.

Bitoku Kishi · Mar 25, 2006, 08:37 PM // 20:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilentAssassin

no not even fissure armour,
fissure armour is just for farmers or ebayers, there is something for everyone

I agree. But the thing about Fissure armor is that it looks different than anything else. And in relation to this, I personally think that green items should have one of two things going for them. Either (a) be better than any collector items, or (b) have completely unique graphic skins.

And I'd actually prefer option (b) out of the two. Then people who just want stuff with good stats can get common-skinned collector items with the same (or at least equivalent) stats, and won't have to worry about high prices on them or the greens. While at the same time, a higher market value on greens, and/or having to spend more time farming them to get them than you do for collector's, could easily be justified in the same way the price of FOW armor is justified; by having unique graphic skins on them.

So this is my suggestion for Factions. Go ahead and make collector's items as good as the new greens, but give every new green item a new completely unique graphic skin. It's the best way to please everyone, I think.

twicky_kid · Mar 25, 2006, 11:33 PM // 23:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrangeArrow

I wonder though what will be at the weapons crafters when the game is released part of me thinks maybe +5 energy one Handed moddable weapons?
Most good pvpers who want them have them and a lot of people have said their value is minimal in pvp... who knows.

I asked gaile about upgradable shields, wands, and focii. She said most likely not until chapter 3. Was looking forward to moding my peppermint sheild

Now THAT is an uber sheild not this -5/20 crap.

Once again I'll do the math. Over 10 hits your -5 would have reduced 10 dmg while a -2 conditional would have reduced 20. Enough said moving on.

Most of these weapons are not stronger than anything else existing in the game. I wonder why that is? Maybe this is a game about TACTICS rather than your equipment. What's the difference between 13% dmg and 15% dmg? Absolutely nothing yet people still want 15.

Btw, I've never traded items for money and I have more than enough for a few accounts. Trading was a horrible money maker after the merchants and greens were introduced.

Accually there is still a +45/-2 enchanted shield but its 12 def. Once again what's the difference between 12 def and 16? Absolutely nothing. Stop complaining and move on to something more important like how keystone sig just became one the most powerfull elites. Or how about that boon sig completely shattering e-denial.

Adaria · Mar 25, 2006, 11:43 PM // 23:43

I don't see a problem in having max collector's items. I got my fire wand in Prophecies that way, otherwise I never would have had a max damage wand, I just like to casually play but still have a chance at good things like those who have the gold and time to spend on farming and buying/selling drops they've found. I honestly don't see why you're so against the max mods, it isn't like they are max until after level 20 anyway, since we're all level 20 right now running around Factions, then well of course they're going to be maxed, but when we create a new character in Factions the day it comes out, we'll start out level 1, and work our way up to those good mods by simply playing the game casually or what not.

angshuman · Mar 25, 2006, 11:59 PM // 23:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bitoku Kishi

I agree. But the thing about Fissure armor is that it looks different than anything else. And in relation to this, I personally think that green items should have one of two things going for them. Either (a) be better than any collector items, or (b) have completely unique graphic skins.

And I'd actually prefer option (b) out of the two. Then people who just want stuff with good stats can get common-skinned collector items with the same (or at least equivalent) stats, and won't have to worry about high prices on them or the greens. While at the same time, a higher market value on greens, and/or having to spend more time farming them to get them than you do for collector's, could easily be justified in the same way the price of FOW armor is justified; by having unique graphic skins on them.

So this is my suggestion for Factions. Go ahead and make collector's items as good as the new greens, but give every new green item a new completely unique graphic skin. It's the best way to please everyone, I think.

Absolutely. /signed.